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Jul 17 07 12:24 PM

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Hi all,

Doing the lip-rolls and tongue-trills, I found that I can reach up to the women's high C. The woman in the demonstration can go higher than that by 'releasing' and 'zipping up' and more of these nice phrases, whereas it seems I hit a roof somewhere. I can sing up to there without a lot of strain, but I can't sing any higher even if I strain. Whatever I do, the high note just ends up to be C.

Now I know it's a bit early to be worrying about that, but I was wondering if others have had this phenomenon. And if so, if you can provide me with some other nice phrases describing your solution. I'm weird like that, when someone describes something I can't do in a different way, maybe I can do it then. :)

BTW, those tongue-trills are really tiring! I've never done them in singing class, and even though my native language (Dutch) has rolled R's, they really wear me out. My tongue feels really funny afterward. :lol
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#1 [url]

Jul 17 07 2:18 PM

Re: Bumping into the top of my range

You mean, the way you are executing the tongue trills is tiring. The tongue trills are not tiring.

Forget about going higher, when you truly forget about going higher, then you will go higher. If you keep it in your mind where it is now (Right now your mind is saying that you cannot go higher, it is saying that there is a "roof", even though there is no such "roof") If you remember that you "can't" go higher all the time, you won't, but if you realize that you can, you will. So dismiss the mind, forget it and you will soon realize that the roof is a mental-physical habit that can only be weakened by paying close attention to it and realizing that it is only that. Once you realize it's only an idea, a judgement, you will see that it is false and that indeed you CAN go higher. If you ever go above the high C everything I have written will be automatically true... so dismiss the idea of the "roof" and the "impossibility" of going above it. We believe in our limitations way too much and that is why they stay there. Don't believe in limitations and there won't be any. All my love.

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#2 [url]

Jul 17 07 2:44 PM

Re: Bumping into the top of my range

Hi, WolfDeca. It seems you're beginning to discover the little intricacies of your individual voice. First let me ask if you're male or female.

From my personal experience, I can go a bit higher in lip rolls than I can with tongue trill. However, I can go my absolute highest vocalizing on just plain old vowels. With tongue trills, I think I can get to maybe an A5 or so, but I haven't done them in a while, so I can't say for sure. On lip trills, I normally can get up to a C6 or C#6, but on occasion, I've reached an Eb6. On plain old vowels, I normally can get up to the A6, although I have gone higher than that by accident on several different occasions. For most purposes, I would consider that A6 to be the top of my range because everything above that isn't really dependable.

Tongue trills tire me out, particularly the back portion of the tongue, if I have to do them for an extended period of time. Using trilled R's in normal speech doesn't bother me, but I think due to the fact that you're using a muscle that you don't normally use in normal speech for such extended periods of time, you become tired. The muscles just aren't accustomed to that kind of rigorous use. It's kind of the same as if you don't normally run then all of a sudden decide you're going to run 5 miles today. It's going to tire you out since your body isn't used to it. However, if you ran daily, this wouldn't bother you quite as much.

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We have eyes, but cannot see; ears, but cannot hear.

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#3 [url]

Jul 17 07 4:01 PM

Re: Bumping into the top of my range

Hi folks, I have a question for you all. Were you able to sing at the A6 range when you first begin your singing journey or did it come one note at a time? TIME being the operative word here.

I definitely need some encouragement here cause no matter how much I "free my mind", release, etc. it seems like (F6 above high C) is shouting back at me "ENOUGH ALREADY!!!".

Regards,
Andre'

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#4 [url]

Jul 17 07 4:38 PM

Re: Bumping into the top of my range

It came from building it up note by note. I didn't really move up until I mastered the ones below it. "Mastered" is used somewhat loosely.

-Joshie

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Angels are among us; when you find them, cherish their presence everyday.

Never argue with an idiot; they'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience. ~ anonymous

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JollyJake

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#5 [url]

Jul 17 07 7:10 PM

Re: Bumping into the top of my range

If the tongue trills are hard, sub in the lip rolls. I never do the tongue trills anymore.

Jake

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#6 [url]

Jul 17 07 8:32 PM

Re: Bumping into the top of my range

Quote:
Hi folks, I have a question for you all. Were you able to sing at the A6 range when you first begin your singing journey or did it come one note at a time? TIME being the operative word here.

When I was around 13, I already had the range up to a B5 or so. As I learned more about what a resonant sound was, I was able to go up to the F6. I just recently figured out how to go up to the A6. All of this was just a matter of figuring out how to coordinate the notes. Because I never had anyone to show me exactly how to do those notes, I had to figure it out on my own. Anytime you're figuring out something on your own, it's probably going to take longer than if you have someone guiding you through the process step-by-step. So as far as time is concerned, it only takes as little or as much time as you need to figure out the coordination.
_____________________________________________________
We have eyes, but cannot see; ears, but cannot hear.

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#7 [url]

Jul 18 07 2:20 AM

Re: Bumping into the top of my range

Musiciano,

Thanks for your reminder. I will forget about going higher for now. I was mostly just playing around before, high spirits, yanno? The high notes will come when they come, and if not, then that's no problem either. If I reach a point where I can depend on all the notes that are in my range at the moment, and not gain another one for the rest of my life, that'd be fine, too. However, I'll find my way up there at some point, and whether that's tomorrow or in 10 years doesn't really matter to me. :)


Cuno,

I'm female. If I were male and able to sing up to female high C, I'd knock myself out from surprise, I think.

I haven't yet compared the trills with the vowels yet, so I'm not aware of any difference there. This would be interesting to try. So far, I've noticed that the Bb below female high C (as featured in the 'mum' exercises) is easily within my range, but it tapers off quite quickly after that. (And when I say within my range, I'm not saying I'd go out on a stage and sing that! I can hit it, but it's not that pretty.)

The tongue trills are getting easier, I've noticed that already. The tongue's supposed to be the strongest muscle in the body, so I'm banking on it that it'll adapt soon.

So far, however, I'm not even that interested in gaining range at the top. My main objective is connecting chest with head better. Chest comes a lot easier to me, and I once made the mistake of going on a 'voice training' course taught by a classically trained soprano who thought all women can sing that high in head. I ended up with 'Me' techniques for chest and 'opera' techniques for head, and the two don't mix. I've had more voice lessons since then, by a better teacher, but I'm not making as much progress on this as I'd like - she can't imagine what I'm doing wrong, so she can't really help me fix it. What happens now is that if I sing without warming up for at least 15 minutes, my chest will break into my head voice (or maybe 'SS falsetto,' since it has a somewhat breathy quality in it. However, it doesn't really FEEL different from what I do when warmed up, so I don't know. Do women even have falsetto?). After the warmup, the break is a lot less noticeable, but there are still some weak tones around E-G above middle C. One reason why I bought the SS programme, is that there are many mid-range exercises in there I hope to benefit from! (BTW, I'm not sure what 'mix' even is. If you connect from chest upwards without breaking noticeably, is that immediately 'mix'? Or can you blend from chest directly into head without passing 'mix'?)

So yeah, that's my main goal: being confident enough that I can cross the bridge without going all breathy and horrible-sounding that I would actually dare using head voice in the songs I perform with my band.

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#8 [url]

Jul 18 07 8:55 AM

Re: Bumping into the top of my range

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I didn't really move up until I mastered the ones below it. "Mastered" is used somewhat loosely.


That's about where I am now, just trying to get better at the notes I can sing by learning how to blend my vocal registries.

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(BTW, I'm not sure what 'mix' even is. If you connect from chest upwards without breaking noticeably, is that immediately 'mix'? Or can you blend from chest directly into head without passing 'mix'?)


I belive that's right. The key words being "without breaking noticeably". I think you have to be in the MIX to smooth out or blend the change in registers.

I personally have dropped my Quest for the A6 for now and instead I'm spending a lot of time working on the mix. I find songs that force me to sing back and forth through my vocal break until I don't notice the break anymore. I haven't dropped my Quest completely though, I also choose songs like "High Enough" by Damn Yankees (Tommy Shaw) just so that I don't dry up on notes in my higher range. Keep hope alive :)

Andre'

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#9 [url]

Jul 19 07 1:37 AM

Re: Bumping into the top of my range

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That's about where I am now, just trying to get better at the notes I can sing by learning how to blend my vocal registries.


Exactly! Well, good luck to you! :)

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I think you have to be in the MIX to smooth out or blend the change in registers.


You sure? I'm not that sure, myself. For example, in this file of me butchering Kansas' Dust in the wind in a ridiculously high key just for your listening enjoyment, I sing mostly in head, with an occasional foray into chest. 'The wind' in the chorus is chest, the rest is what I'd call 'head.' Feels pretty 'head' to me, and not at all chesty. So you're saying that's (probably very light) mix? Or head progressing rather smoothly into chest, without passing MIX and without collecting $200?

(Just as a comparison, listen to the same piece of music recorded before vocal warmup. What a difference 15 minutes make! :) That's another reason I don't think the first clip is mix, 'cause I feel I'm doing the same thing in both clips and the no-warmup one is obviously a really breathy head/falsetto.)

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#12 [url]

Jul 19 07 9:37 AM

mix

Wolf, you are getting there. You weren't in your mix register there, except maybe when you dropped into chest voice. Mix is just an easier way to sing in chest voice! Adding head takes the pressure of the chords.

Your head voice sounds pretty good, except you are still gripping your notes with your mind and your body. When you vocalize don't try to sound so good. Let it sound wierd and crazy. Don't hold onto the notes so hard. I myself micro-manage my body and that is holding me back.

-David

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#13 [url]

Jul 19 07 11:23 AM

Re: mix

Wolf, I have to agree with Admirald. I don't think you have a range issue here, so let your voice take you where it wants to go (head or chest) instead of where you want it to go and the Mix will come in time. Relax and enjoy the sensation.

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